Josh McNally is quick to acknowledge the big part the RAF played in his career taking off.
It was only when he joined the services that he took up the sport and it was through the support of his employers that he was able to forge a career as a professional player.
He went on to represent England during his time with Bath and is now loving life with Cardiff Rugby who he joined last summer.
The 34-year-old second row has established himself as a pivotal figure for the Arms Park outfit, appearing in 19 of their 21 matches this season, a major contribution which has been rewarded with a contract extension.
He’s helped them push for the BKT URC Play-Offs, with a top eight finish now very much within their sights as they head into their tour of South Africa and games against the Vodacom Bulls and DHL Stormers in the final two rounds of the campaign.
McNally is still serving in the RAF now – holding the rank of sergeant – and played for them against the Navy last month, packing down on the blindside flank.
“I joined up when I was 19. I hadn’t really played rugby before that,” he explains.
“I started playing in the Air Force because sport is quite a big thing in the military.
“My rugby started going in the right direction, I got on a bit of a decent trajectory and then I started playing professionally when I was 25.
“The RAF have been fantastic. They have the elite athletes scheme where they withdraw you from your job and allow you to pursue whatever sport it is. We have got guys in the Olympics, athletics, even managers and coaches.
“If there is an opportunity to do it, you can go and play and compete full-time professionally. So they have been great and, when rugby comes to an end, I will go back and serve.
“The RAF has played a crucial role in my career. They opened the door for me to pursue professional rugby and I’m extremely grateful for their ongoing support.
“I don’t spend any time working there currently. My trade is as an engineer, I was a weapons engineer. It’s very difficult to pop away on a Wednesday and do that!
“But I still try to keep my hand in and help with sport and leadership stuff and just try and give back a little bit.
“The two jobs are not far apart really. All the qualities you use here – discipline, team work, leadership – are pretty matching to the military, so it’s been a good fit.”
The Cambridgeshire-born and Hereford-raised McNally had spells with Henley, London Welsh and London Irish before beginning a five-year stay with Bath in 2019, going on to be capped by England against the USA at Twickenham in July 2021.
After being released at the end of last season, he was ready to step away from rugby, but joining Cardiff has given him a new lease of life.
“I didn’t play much with Bath last year,” he says.
“An injury came at the wrong time for me and then they were into knock-out rugby.
“The club made a new decision and moved in a different direction. Thankfully, I have come to another opportunity here that has paid off for me personally.
“A year ago, I was ready to step away from rugby, but coming to Cardiff has reignited my love for the game.”
The father-of-two continues: “Talking to Jockey (coach Matt Sherratt) before I signed, it was about what I could bring off the field as well as on it.
“It’s been a perfect move for me.
“I have contributed a lot more on the field than I probably thought I was going to, at my age.
“If Jockey had said at the start of the season that I would play 19 of the first 21 games, I would have laughed at him. “But the body feels good and, as long as that is ok, I will continue to play. I am thoroughly enjoying it.
“Coming here, I fell back in love with it. It’s been a really nice club to come to. It’s been refreshing. With the style of rugby Cardiff want to play, I have absolutely loved it.”
The 6ft 7ins, 19st 13lbs lock added: “I am not high speed, I am not trying to run around like a lunatic, but I feel I can read the game well enough that I can still compete at this level, while contributing where I can in the tighter areas.
“My role here is firstly doing my job on the pitch, but I have also absolutely loved working with this new young Welsh generation.
“The future of Cardiff is going to be great when we have got a core of players that are young and hungry and eager to learn and get better.
“It’s been amazing to come here and help out where I can and be a part of that journey. To be in this environment, in this culture and just add a little bit here and there, I have loved it. It’s been a great place to be.
“My first season has been a truly special one and I’m thrilled to have signed for one more year. I feel incredibly fortunate to be extending my time with a club full of amazing people, with passionate fans in a fantastic city.
“I genuinely enjoy coming to work every day. This club has such a proud history and it’s an honour to be part of it.
“I’m excited now to finish this season strong.”
Which brings us round to the games away to the Bulls and Stormers as fifth-placed Cardiff look to nail down a play-off spot.
“The South African teams play a great brand of rugby,” said McNally.
“They are extremely physical and there is definitely a place for them in the competition.
“When some of the best players in the world are in your league, that makes your league a lot better.
“From a personal perspective, you want to put yourself up there and compete with the best in the world and having the South Africans in our league does that. I enjoy them being in the URC and look forward to competing against them.”